| Author |
Message |
    
Nancy Mehl
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, February 24, 2002 - 03:19 pm: |   |
Hi, guys!
C.E., Dennis and I have been talking about trying something new on the board. I don't know about you, but I'm drowning in promotional tips! There are so many, I just don't know where to start.
Our idea is this: Each week, Dennis and I will post "one" promotional tip. Your assignment, should you decide to take it, (no, there's not a tape that will self-destruct!) will be to "do" the assignment for that week. In a year's time, we will have accomplished 52 promotional assignments. This should pay off big time for us!
If everyone does this together, we can report back our success rate to the group. This should give us a way to streamline our activities.
If you have a good tip, please e-mail it to Dennis or I - and we will put it into the pot. One thing I ask, please don't post lots of ideas here - it could muddy up the topic and put us right back where we started. One idea a week - posted by me or Dennis, okay?
Dennis will post the first idea. It's one I've been meaning to do for quite a while. I have it on good authority that it's a winner. Basic - but important. If this takes off, and we get a lot of participation, C.E. will set up a separate thread for us.
Let us know what you think. Your comments are welcome. Please post those here.
Dennis - the tip for the upcoming week?
Nancy |
Dennis Collins
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, February 24, 2002 - 04:31 pm: | |
Greetings............
Our first recommended "Tip of the Week" is to join a writer's group that is allied with your genre.
In my case, I'm a member of Mystery Writer's of America, Private Eye Writer's of America, and Sisters in Crime (Yes, they accept male members).
The advantage to be gained here is in "Shared Resources". Many agents and publishers are "focused" in one genre and so your efforts are less likely to be wasted if you pursue avenues that fit your work. The rewards can be dramatic.
I can only speak for the mystery crowd but it is through these organizations that I have made my most effective contacts.
Another tremendous benefit is that most major contests are sponsored by these groups. eg: The Edgar Allen Poe Awards - Mystery Writer's of America - The Shamus Awards - Private Eye Writer's
Victoria or CE can help out the Sci-fi and fantasy writer's and I know that the Romance Writer's Association has a strong presence all over the Internet and I'm sure that your friendly search engine will turn up scores more. |
C. E. Winterland
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, February 24, 2002 - 07:43 pm: | |
And I think that you will find if you go to the Links Portal and follow the "Writers" link that most of the major genres are represented there.
Just a lil tip from me 
GOOD IDEA!!! Thanks Dennis and Nancy!
CEW |
C. E. Winterland
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, February 24, 2002 - 08:12 pm: | |
Did it.
Just filled out my SFWA application and put it in the mail. I promised Victoria I would do that almost a whole year ago... I guess I'm finally ready to reap the benefits of such a great organization! (read: 'please help me...')
CEW |
Nancy Mehl
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, February 24, 2002 - 08:37 pm: | |
I will be joining Sisters in Crime and MWA this week. Something I've intended to do for a long time.
I'll let everyone know when it's done!
Nancy |
laurelj
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, February 25, 2002 - 02:55 am: | |
You folks are just so smart. I haven't quite made that transition yet.
Nancy already knows what my first book is genre-wise since she is reviewing it for MyShelf. But my second and third books are nothing like that. Yes, my writing style stays much the same but the content is far different. (The closest I can come to giving a vague comparison is The Thorn Birds maybe, if anyone read that.) I consider my subsequent books mainstream, but with a very strong male-female attachment - and all that implies - between the two main characters. My books are NOT romance genre fiction per se. What sort of writers group would I contact?
I will check out C.E.s links as he mentioned and see if I can figure something out. Thanks.
LaurelJ |
Vickie Adkins
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, February 25, 2002 - 05:37 am: | |
Hey guys! Great idea. But, as with Laurel, I might need a little direction. Tattered Pages was a fictional, inspirational, mystery, romance, etc. I just finished my first children's book (seeking an agent), am currently working on a part nonfiction/fiction about the freed slave that's buried in our pioneer cemetery, a strictly inspirational one, and one about how paraplegia changes your life.
Us "newbies" might need a little direction here. Would it be possible to post a few ideas/sites to check out. Hey, by the way, I also need an assistant, an editor, a masseuse, a gourmet chef, a full time maid, someone to run a bulldozer, and an interior decorator. 
Currently, I belong to Christian Writer's Group, Children's writers, and one for Lyricists.
I need a vacation. Oh, by the way, next Sunday I'm leaving for a 7-day cruise in the Carribean. So I will be posting away, then POOF! I'll be gone for a while.
By the way, Mindsight is my favorite forum. Thanx everyone who participates!
Best,
Vickie |
C. E. Winterland
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, February 25, 2002 - 06:34 am: | |
Believe it or not, I can run yer bulldozer...
But since you get to go on a week long cruise... I don't think I will. I have too much work to do hehehe.
Glad to hear that the forum does good for you!
CEW |
C. E. Winterland
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, February 26, 2002 - 06:36 am: | |
Hello all,
I just made the purple notice on the main page a direct link to this thread so you can access this topic DIRECTLY from the main page.
CEW |
laurelj
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, February 26, 2002 - 05:54 pm: | |
Well, I checked out all the links C.E. had posted and still don't know what genre my second and third book fit into. 
You've read the intro to Snowbird Dying, C.E. Is it Romance if they're wannabes? I don't think so, but heck, what do I know? My second book is dark and psychological too, even if it DOES have lovers in it, so the genre still escapes me unless it's mainstream.
Laurel |
C. E. Winterland
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, February 26, 2002 - 07:17 pm: | |
Laurel,
Check out http://www.writerswrite.net/orgsrch.cfm?search=general
See if you find anything in there... looks like a pretty good listing.
CEW |
laurelj
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 27, 2002 - 05:09 am: | |
Thanks C.E. Lots of great links there. Guess I will just close my eyes and point, then pick one.
Laurel |
Kevin P. Grover
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 27, 2002 - 05:23 am: | |
Vickie...I might be able to help with an editor...
Not really any contribution to this thread, but wanted to show an example of perserverence.
4 highly possible reviews for both SH and SS coming up. They are:
Bookreporter
American Book Review
Midwest Book Review
People magazine
Laurel---I don't think it really matters about genre. Primarily, it can be billed to what YOU feel it is. I've used thriller, suspense, mystery, and adventure to categorize Strike Hard. They all fit, so i use whichever moniker I feel will get the most attention from the audience I'm addressing. Works every time! |
Vickie Adkins
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 27, 2002 - 07:04 am: | |
I'm praying you get the PEOPLE one. I read those reviews religiously. That would be a plus for all of us, to get a PA author listed....
I have an editor, but thanx! Rest assured, I won't make the same mistakes with editing that I did on the first book.
Vickie |
Kevin P. Grover
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 27, 2002 - 10:48 am: | |
Here's an idea that may or may not work for some, but I'm going to give it a try.
I bought 7 copies of Strike Hard from Amazon, under their "free shipping" promotion. All-in-all, it cost me $107.00 to get them.
Now. I am going to post them on Amazon for sale as collectables. I am going to offer that they will be signed and personalized for the buyer. I figure that if I offer them at $27.50 each, I will make my money back after only selling 4, so the rest are profit. On top of that, I get the royalty for selling 7. If it goes well, I may move into the E-bay realm, or even continue on the Amazon thing for a couple of times.
Just an idea I thought I'd try out. THe good thing is that anyone who buys it will certainly talk about it to friends, who may want to get a copy themselves. I figure that if I at least make my money back, it should generate some word-of-mouth. |
Dennis Collins
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 27, 2002 - 01:07 pm: | |
Laurel..... Has your book been reviewed by any professional reviewers? They would have put it into a genre category at that time. You might also think about bringing it up at Amazon.com and look down at the bottom of your listing. My book is listed in at least 5 or 6 categories.
Speaking of reviews....... Has anybody here ever received a less than glowing review? How'd you handle it? Did it discourage you or intensify your determination? I'd love to hear those stories. I think that we will all encounter a clinker of a review sooner or later, and I'm not talking about some idiot troll. We need to be prepared and decide how to deal with it. |
Nancy Mehl
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 27, 2002 - 01:33 pm: | |
Dennis,
Except for reviews by our "troll" friend, I haven't received any "negative" reveiws. However, I have gotten three 4 star reviews on Amazon. One, was from another author who told me that she only picked 4 stars because she didn't want the review to look "contrived." AAARRRGGHH! She said she really thought the book deserved 5 stars.
The others are from reviewers I don't know. They gave me good reviews - but I REALLY want to ask them why they didn't pick 5 stars. Not because I think the book deserves 5 stars, but because sometimes, a little negative feedback is helpful. I know the problems with the book. I wrote it several years ago, and believe that I am a better writer now. But, I would love to know if they are seeing the same things I am. I may write them, haven't decided. I don't want to seem unprofessional.
Nancy |
Kevin P. Grover
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 27, 2002 - 01:35 pm: | |
I have gotten a couple of "less than glowing" reviews. Personally, I welcome them. More people will see a movie that has been trashed by the reviewers than won't. Also, less people will go see a movie the reviewers have praised beyond belief because they feel that it isn't good, but has been elevated for one reason or another.
Personally, I feel that if I were to receive all 5-star reviews, they wouldn't be honest ones. I generally look at what is said, then if it's something I wish to incorporate into my writing, I do. If not, then I say to myself, "I'll do it the way I want and if they don't like it then phooey!" |
laurelj
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 27, 2002 - 02:47 pm: | |
Kevin,
I know what genre my first book - The Grass Dance - falls under. It is in the process of being reviewed by professionals.
It is my unpublished seond and third books that I am questioning in reference to the tip of the month. The only modern book I could compare them to is The Thorn Birds. (No I'm not comparing myself to Colleen McCullough.)
So that's why I say my fiction books are mainstream.
Nancy Mehl,
Still haven't had a reply back from St. Kitts re: ordering SS in pre release. Would a call be better received?
Laurel J |
Jennifer Lynn
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 27, 2002 - 05:21 pm: | |
Wow, this is a great idea for a thread!! I've been lurking for a while, busy with editing and stuff,but now that the worst is over, I figure I can breathe a little.
I joined a newbie romance writers online group, called ToBeez...its basically a place where new romance authors who have made their first sale can exchange promotional ideas and chat. There are some great things there from the authors who now have more than one novel out. It's a Yahoo Group, so if anyone wants the link, let me know and I'll find it and post it.
Kevin, I like your idea about the 'collectables'. I'll be curious to see how it works out for you!
I've also spent a lot of time puttering around romance sites, dropping the occasional message on their boards, and now I am listed on three sites. One of them has an interview, and another just emailed me with some interview questions which they will post when they review my novel. It ain't much, but it's a start.
Anyways, that's it for my ramblings.
Jenn |
Nancy Marie
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 27, 2002 - 08:37 pm: | |
Nancy - I also would like to know why a reviewer gives less than the maximum number of stars. My one and only review, so far, gave me 3 and 1/2 stars out of a possible 4. So that's really pretty good, but I'd like to know what held her back from giving it a full 4 stars. If I knew that then I could make sure I didn't do the same things in the next book.
Oh well, maybe somebody'll clue me in some day.
smiles and blessings, Kitty |
Nancy Mehl
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, March 02, 2002 - 07:34 pm: | |
Okay. Sent my membership payment into Sisters in Crime. I have to wait a bit for MWA - because the membership is pretty expensive. But, my application is on my desk.
Has everyone done their homework? Remember, if you'll follow the tips here, we'll all be selling a lot more books.
Dennis, I'll be at a book signing in Manhattan, Kansas tomorrow. (Waldenbooks in the mall if anyone is near there.)
Will you set up the next topic (week two) and post the next tip?
Nancy |
laurelj
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, March 03, 2002 - 04:30 am: | |
I flunked my week one assignment.
Have never figured out what genre I fit into. The Grass Dance was spiritual non fiction - not my usual genre.
So I am waiting until I figure out where I fit in. Fiction is all I know for sure.
Laurel J |
C. E. Winterland
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, March 03, 2002 - 03:29 pm: | |
Laurel,
I don't think you can flunk... Just thinking about it for a week has probably helped you to narrow down the range of areas The Grass Dance fits into. Besides, is it all that necessary to pigeon hole it if it doesn't easily or readily fit into any of the paradigms set out there? That is what the classification of 'mainstream' is for, no?
Still, as a make-up assignment, you are still required to get into a writer's organization if you would like to pass this semester... hehehe.
CEW |
laurelj
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, March 03, 2002 - 04:50 pm: | |
It isnt the Grass Dance I'm pondering, C.E. I know it is non fiction, spiritual. It was a one shot deal, written for my family mostly. It is my second and third books that escape pigeon holing. Fictionalized allegories.
The are not romance genre in any sense that I can figure. And aren't mainstream exactly either. Not SFF. Not action thrillers or mysteries.
So now I'm back to flunking out.
laurelj |
femazur.com
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, March 03, 2002 - 08:19 pm: | |
A couple of comments here about starred reviews prompts me to contribute my perpsective on the matter. And I have long-time friends (not talking about other PA writers) who write and read and others who read only, and I know they share my perspective on the subject because we've had the discussion. In other words, if I was the only one to think this way, I wouldn’t post. As I'm not, it may be of some interest to others to be aware of this.
First, the stars on a review mean little to me. Truthfully, I wish they weren't an option. The same is true of those reviews which contain statements such as, "I highly recommend this book." I am really interested in the written review itself, against which I can match what I might already know about the book, its author, and the reviewer. It is this matching process that causes me—in part, anyway—to read a book or not. I'm looking for a thoughtful review, but in any review I am always judging the reviewer's overall knowledge plus ability to express it, quality of insight if there is any, restraint of ego, biases, and sundry other things—even when the reviewers are ones whom I respect, having read many of their book reviews in the past. And I match all this against the book blurb and anything else I might know about the work and its author.
The fact is, though, in many forums the stars are an option. But what are they to mean? Some of you, in your statements, appear to be disappointed if you get anything fewer than five stars. That four stars means there might be something wrong with your book. Let me further my perspective. Again, not because it is mine alone, but because there are others out there with the same or similar view.
I would give a book five stars if I believed the book was special, if it stood out from other comparable volumes; but especially if I thought it was a book that would stand some test of time, like ten or twenty, or even thirty years. My take on predicting a 'modern' classic.
I would give a book four stars if it was basically equal in all other respects, but lacked that above.
A three-star review from me means the book is recommended—without saying it—but that I think it isn't for everyone, and so the potential reader might want to check out other reviews, or something else in any case, before making up his or her mind. Don't rely on me, in other words.
Two stars and you still might want to read the book, although don’t say I didn't warn you.
One star, I think, speaks for itself.
I wish starred reviews would go away altogether because they minimize the review itself. I wish they would disappear because they're prevalence, especially five starred reviews, is so commonplace that they are not to be trusted. I wish they would evaporate into thin air because they diminish the value of the word. I wish they were not an option because it is too easy to select stars than think and write clearly about one's thoughts on what they have read.
F.E. Mazur, SPINE
www.femazur.com |
Nancy Mehl
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, March 03, 2002 - 08:46 pm: | |
Laurel,
Rather than worry about genres - why not pick a couple of strong writers groups? Some groups are not genre restricted.
Sorry I have been much help - but this week has been really busy.
I'll try to help you search for a couple of groups this week, okay?
Nancy |
C. E. Winterland
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 04, 2002 - 12:47 am: | |
Hello F.E.,
I reacted as you did to the stars thing... thinking that it would be a very rare book indeed that would get 5... but then I reread the posting.
I think that what was being said was WHY are there less than 5, as in, what criticism is there of the book in question. As you and all of us know, that critical outlook helps us all as writers, and it is not always easy to get the constructive criticism.
Nice to see you, I hope you'll drop in and give some more insight to the forum group.
CEW |
laurelj
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 04, 2002 - 03:36 am: | |
If I feel a writer has reached - or almost reached - that perfect stage of ripeness, if they use colorful metaphors and paint word pictures I can see, feel, smell, and if they can draw me into a story and keep me there, they get a five. If I think they have room for growth and will gain maturity in their writing, they get a four. If the book has a few saving graces and I made it through, three stars. If it sucks below three stars I don't write a review.
So yes, the star ratings are dependent on the rater's thoughts, both subjective and objective I guess.
LaurelJ |
femazur.com
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 04, 2002 - 04:46 am: | |
C.E.--
The last time I stopped by, you told me what was being said. You need to stop doing that! Really. I too re-read the post and know that what they said is what you said. In a sense they are treating the stars as A_B_C_D_F with A a 5 and F a 1. But if the reviewer has rated the book in the manner that I do, their reach to interpret meaning won't work, as basically there isn't much difference between a 5 and a 3, and the latter in no way means that there is something "wrong" with the book. It would not have received a 5 because I thought it would not stand the test of time. Nor a 4 because I thought it wasn't for everybody. My message was simply this: Don't beat on yourself, because you might be thinking you're working with an apple when it's actually an orange.
F.E. Mazur,SPINE
www.femazur.com |
femazur.com
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 04, 2002 - 04:53 am: | |
Laurel--
Have you ever read any John O'Hara? He was always one of my favorites. Anyway, he did not believe in using metaphors, colorful or otherwise. Yet he was certainly good enough to have many a piece appear in the New Yorker.
F.E. Mazur,SPINE
www.femazur.com |
C. E. Winterland
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 04, 2002 - 05:55 am: | |
Hey FE, you know, after I posted that, I thought the same thing, LOL. Sorry about that. I really did have to reread the stars postings though, because I thought it was strange that it seemed to be saying that everyone deserves a 5-star hehehe.
Hope you won't hold that against me
CEW |
C. E. Winterland
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 04, 2002 - 05:56 am: | |
Dennis... do you have new promotional tip for this week? |
laurelj
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 04, 2002 - 07:52 am: | |
I don't think everyone deserves a 5-star rating. Everything has to come together as a fine whole to warrant five stars. But of course, my reviewing skills surely are not comparable to any professional reviewer who might come to mind. I freely admit to not being an accomplished reviewer.
No I have never read O'Hara that I can recall, F.E. I tend to like books that are rich with descriptive passages and work me emotionally. However, I do enjoy Steinbeck who had a spare but effective writing style.
I am reviewing a book right now for AAS that has almost boggled my mind, it seems so real. And guess what, C.E. It is SFF!! I am reading it with a new appreciation after having read your work.
LaurelJ |
Kevin P. Grover
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 04, 2002 - 08:22 am: | |
My promo tip for this week:
Print a bunch of business cards with your cover, ISBN and such on one side, and a short (sentence or two) description on the other. (These can be done at home for peanuts). Drop them everywhere...penny jars, Department/grocery store bulletin boards, etc. pretty soon someone will notice it and perhaps gain interest...which will result in at least a few sales! |
Kevin P. Grover
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 04, 2002 - 08:23 am: | |
Oh...might want to add an e-mail address...in case they have a question for you. You always want to sponsor contact betwen yourself and your readers! |
laurelj
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 04, 2002 - 12:25 pm: | |
Gosh kids. Whatever marketing I've done must have paid off in spades. My amazon.com ranking has climbed to a staggering 2,214,000!! Never thought I'd see the day. (I know, I know. It's horrible. Just had to make a wise crack.)
laurelj |
Kevin P. Grover
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 04, 2002 - 12:40 pm: | |
LOL Laurel...mine moved up a little today also....it moved up a huge 154 points. |
laurelj
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 04, 2002 - 02:49 pm: | |
Here is another funny that might explain my huge honking ranking. A lady called me today who tried to order my book on amazon and they told her it would not be available again until the end of APRIL. She planned to see if b and n could produce any faster than that.
Laurel J |
Jennifer Lynn
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 04, 2002 - 03:13 pm: | |
One thing that I am doing in preparation of my novel's release, is to prepare book plates that can be autographed and sent to whomever requests them. Don't know about you, but I've had TONS of people say 'I want an autographed copy'. I quickly explain to them that authors do not get thousands of books to give away free, so they will have to order their own copy, and then I'll be happy to mail them a bookplate.
I'm using 4" x 3" shipping labels (self adhesive), and at the top I placed the title of my novel in big bold letters, and below it a little blurby 'From my library to yours--Jennifer Lynn' in italics. At the very bottom I've my website address along with a little blurby to check there for news, new releases, latest contest and other fun things. In the middle, of course, is lots of space for an autograph, and anything I might want to add.
I figure mailing a label is far cheaper than the cost of the book, plus postage!!!
Jennifer |
Gloria Marlow
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, March 27, 2002 - 09:21 pm: | |
Okay, does this count?
I think I joined iuniverse's wicked company. Not quite sure though. Also, not sure, is it open to all or just iuniverse authors? Does anyone know?
Also, I went to DorothyL. That was frightening. Overwhelming may be the word. I don't really understand how that works. Someone familiar with it, please explain.
That was it for me tonight. Someone please advise if these are "groups" or not. I don't know that I could join a group that actually requires going to meetings and things like that. Do I have to? I know it helps, but three kids, hubby, dinner, dishes, etc. etc. keep me tied pretty close to home for now. I finally got up the nerve to commit to Little League for the youngest one. So, unless, there are meetings there of a writers' group, I'm out of luck.
Thanks,
Gloria |
Nancy Mehl
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, March 27, 2002 - 09:35 pm: | |
You did good, Gloria. Yes, Wicked Company is for all authors, especially POD authors. Contact Claudia McCants. She does the previews. Ask her if she might be able to preview your book.
What kind of questions do you have about DorothyL? Ask me specific questions and I'll answer you. Be sure to read the "rules" of the forum first. Some things are frowned upon.
These are great groups. I belong to both.
Nancy |
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Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 06, 2006 - 02:29 pm: | |
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