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Bill Park (Unregistered Guest)
Work-in-progress guest
Posted From: 65.66.154.103
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, November 10, 2003 - 03:13 pm: |   |
Agents, publishers, bookstores, contests, often ask what category novel have you written: Mainstream Fiction, Literary Fiction, Genre Fiction, Alternative Fiction?
Wouldn't mainstream fiction include mystery, sci-fi, suspense, thriller, adventure, romance, inspirational, etc. Or are they each considered genre fiction? Is a mainstream fiction subject something that will not easily fit a specific genre category? Is literary fiction considered 'interllectual' fiction? And is alternative fiction, alternative life-style fiction?
The category subject can be confusing...and could be considered different depending on the person/company requesting an answer. |
C. E. Winterland
Mindsight Moderator
Post Number:
1229
Registered: 06-2002
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, November 10, 2003 - 05:33 pm: | |
I guess you have to attack this question by method of a process of elimination...
Genre fiction is mystery, horror, sci-fi, suspense, romance, etc...
Mainstream fiction is something that everyone can read, right? Not too dirty, not too heathen, not too far out, not too technical...
Literary fiction is the 'art for art's sake' category. Actually, I heard it said once that literary fiction is like mainstream fiction, but has no plot (wink). Just a joke.
Alternative fiction would be what you can't stuff into those nice neat generalizations (no pun intended).
I'm sure someone has a comprehensive set of definitions for these terms (and others). I pretty much stick to the genre thing for the moment though, so I suppose I'm pigeon holing myself.
CEW |
Steven Shrewsbury
Hsympothai Member
Post Number:
421
Registered: 04-2003
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, December 04, 2003 - 07:07 pm: | |
I hate the term "fantasy" that is placed on anythgin where a sword is used. Historical High Fantasy? Seems too long. The stuff I do in that realm is almsot alt history, in its own way...or waht the history book doesn't tell you.
The Dack Shannon stuff is sorta government conspiracy, horror, mystery etc...or as Chris Fulbright says, dash of THE SHADOW, Phillip Marlowe...righteous vengance...
If I am doing sci fi, horror or wahtever, there is usually humor involved. It is more an element of style.
Writers write. |
Bill Park (Unregistered Guest)
Work-in-progress guest
Posted From: 65.66.152.195
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, December 04, 2003 - 07:47 pm: | |
Steven...did you happen to read the novel TIMELINE? I enjoyed the book adapted for film that's now playing in theaters everywhere. Have to go see it! But I'm certain that I'll be disappointed. Sometimes one's own imagine is far superior than Hollywood's interpretation. |
Claudia Turner VanLydegraf
Mindsight Moderator
Post Number:
742
Registered: 06-2002
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, December 04, 2003 - 09:15 pm: | |
Bill,
I went and saw the movie on Sunday, and I did NOT read the book, but was highly impressed with the movie. It really was good. Chrichton (sp?) did a really good job writing the book and my friend who was with me at the movie, says his book and the movie are almost excatly the same. Course, I am a history buff, and that made the enjoyment all the better for me.
Claudia |
Todd Hunter
Wisdom Member
Post Number:
987
Registered: 02-2003
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, December 05, 2003 - 05:31 am: | |
I imagine Crichton was in the loop on creating the movie version (since he's a big shot producer as well), so can't imagine there would be too many major differences... |
Steven Shrewsbury
Hsympothai Member
Post Number:
422
Registered: 04-2003
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, December 05, 2003 - 06:16 am: | |
Yeah, Bill, I read it a year or so ago. It was a good book. One of the knights in the book was one who carried the Shroud of Turin aroudn Europe for a bit in his life, though that is a bit of hsitory, not mentioned in the tale 
I know, I spend waaaaaay too much tiem reading history.
The movie looks pretty good. Any film with that much action in it looks alright. I need to get to see it this weekend.
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Fred Dungan
Hsympothai Member
Post Number:
450
Registered: 10-2002
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, December 09, 2003 - 12:01 am: | |
I have been reading about the Knights Templar, the half-time monk, full-time warrior guardians of the Holy Land during the Crusades. This was no-quarter-asked, no-quarter-given warfare that was being continuously waged from the late 12th century to the late 14th century. The contemporary descriptions of the battles are infinitely more revolting than anything I have ever come across in fiction. What amazed me most is that many of these knights retained their stamina into their 60's and 70's. I guess it shows what celibacy and plenty of exercise can do for you.
http://www.fdungan.com/sent.htm
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Steven Shrewsbury
Hsympothai Member
Post Number:
430
Registered: 04-2003
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, December 09, 2003 - 05:36 am: | |
Interesting note, Fred, that when the Germanic or Teutonic Knights gave up their oaths of celibacy etc later on, some of the Germanic/Austrian royal line comes from their selves.
There is a great book about the Teutonic knights that has a title that escapes me...oh yeah, MONKS OF WAR....great, bloody stuff. One tale is how some folks in what is now Russia roasted a knight in his armor like a chestnut.
Lots of tidbits, like they wiped out an entire pagan religion near Finland and no one really knows what they worshiped.
The TEMPLARS, dang, I could go on about them for hours...my dad was a mason... |
Dennis Collins
Mindsight Moderator
Post Number:
896
Registered: 06-2002
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, May 31, 2004 - 06:40 am: | |
An editor recently admonished me for using three different coincidences in the same 80,000 word manuscript. He said that one coincidence per novel is all that is acceptable. He evidently doesn't read the newspapers.
The following article was sent to me as a TRUE story...
At the 1994 annual awards dinner given for Forensic Science,
AAFS President Dr. Don Harper Mills astounded his audience with
the legal complications of a bizarre death. Here is the story:
On March 23, 1994 the medical examiner viewed the body of Ronald Opus
and concluded that he died from a shotgun wound to the head. Mr. Opus
had jumped from the top of a ten-story building intending to commit suicide.
He left a note to the effect indicating his despondency.
As he fell past the ninth floor his life was interrupted by
a shotgun blast passing through a window, which killed
him instantly.
Neither the shooter nor the deceased was aware that a
safety net had been installed just below the eighth floor
level to protect some building workers and that Ronald
Opus would not have been able to complete his suicide
the way he had planned.
"Ordinarily," Dr Mills continued, "Someone who sets out to
commit suicide and ultimately succeeds, even though the
mechanism might not be what he intended, is still defined
as committing suicide." That Mr. Opus was shot on the way
to certain death, but probably would not have been successful
because of the safety net, caused the medical examiner to feel
that he had a homicide on his hands.
In the room on the ninth floor, where the shotgun blast emanated,
was occupied by an elderly man and his wife. They were arguing
vigorously and he was threatening her with a shotgun. The man
was so upset that when he pulled the trigger he completely
missed his wife and the pellets went through the window striking
Mr. Opus.
When one intends to kill subject "A" but kills subject "B" in the
attempt, one is guilty of the murder of subject "B."
When confronted with the murder charge the old man and his wife
were both adamant and both said that they thought the shotgun
was not loaded.
The old man said it was a long-standing habit to threaten his wife
with the unloaded shotgun. He had no intention to murder her.
Therefore the killing of Mr.Opus appeared to be an accident; that is,
assuming the gun had been accidentally loaded.
The continuing investigation turned up a witness who saw the old
couple's son loading the shotgun about six weeks prior to the fatal
accident.
It transpired that the old lady had cut off her son's financial support
and the son, knowing the propensity of his father to use the shotgun
threateningly, loaded the gun with the expectation that his father
would shoot his mother.
Since the loader of the gun was aware of this, he was guilty of the
murder even though he didn't actually pull the trigger.
The case now becomes one of murder on the part of the son for the
death of Ronald Opus.
Now comes the exquisite twist.
Further investigation revealed that the son was, in fact, Ronald
Opus. He had become increasingly despondent over the failure
of his attempt to engineer his mother's murder. This led him to
jump off the ten-story building on March 23rd, only to be killed
by a shotgun blast passing through the ninth story window. The
son had actually murdered himself so the medical examiner closed
the case as a suicide.
A true story from Associated Press, Reported by Kurt Westervelt
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Nancy Mehl
Mindsight Moderator
Post Number:
1795
Registered: 08-2001
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, May 31, 2004 - 08:47 am: | |
Oh my gosh. That's one of the strangest stories I've ever heard!
Nancy
www.nancymehlbooks.com
www.myshelf.com |
Claudia Turner VanLydegraf
Mindsight Moderator
Post Number:
1304
Registered: 06-2002
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, May 31, 2004 - 08:54 am: | |
That's wild.
I wonder who that editor thinks he is that he has the right to decide if things that actually happen in true life are worth less because they have two or more coincidental occurrences? You should send him that story and tell him that even though you know for most purposes, he is correct, there are however, always certain things that can and do happen in reality that often defy the laws and rules and therefore, the same should be held possible in the literary world.
Some stories are all the more believable, because of the use of many conicidences, take this weeks block-buster movie... oh, all right, it is not a perfect example, but the people are thronging to the movies theaters to see several very unlikely things all happening at just the perfect time to get this story rolling and the box offices are raking in the bucks. Or that the movie, "Perfect Storm" that was a real depiction of three coincdental things all happening at just the right time, or the Poisidon Adventure, and there are many other movies, books, stories, out there that have many more than just one amazing thing in them.
I would have to agree with him on the norm, but most of the bigger movies and books that are selling like hotcakes today are based on many things that by their very nature are unlikely to all happen at just that right time. Maybe, what he should have told you instead, is that you might have a block-buster on your hands if you can tighten it up a bit and he can persuade his publisher to take a chance on you/it. (but he didn't want to go out on a limb as say anything to make you feel better about it, so he instead, said that you CAN'T do this type of thing arbitraily.) Maybe he just turned down the next biggest hit, Dennis.....
Claudia |
Dennis Collins
Mindsight Moderator
Post Number:
898
Registered: 06-2002
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, May 31, 2004 - 10:52 am: | |
In my opinion the "coincidences" that he pointed out weren't all that coincidental.
My heroine and one of the bad guys had shared the same cultural circles in the past. They lived in the same city, did drugs, and were involved in the rock band scene. Now, she's away from drugs but still involved with a rock band in the same city and they encounter one another again. I don't see that as a coincidence. It's a likely happenstance.
A newspaper reporter who is quite aware of the situation that McCoy is involved in is investigating a possible story at a hospital when he comes across another victim in the case. I don't see this as being totally coincidental either. Investigative reporters investigate and they find things.
This one is a coincidence... My heroine is running from the murderer and is found in the woods by Michael O'Conner, one of my protagonists. |
LaurieAnne
Unity Member
Post Number:
1480
Registered: 12-2001
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, May 31, 2004 - 06:36 pm: | |
The editor is obviously in the class of depriving a village somewhere...LOL.
As for that article, Holy Moses! Talk about coming full circle. Hmm.
Stranger than fiction.
LA
LaurieAnne
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J. Evans (Unregistered Guest)
Work-in-progress guest
Posted From: 192.132.24.81
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, June 01, 2004 - 12:32 pm: | |
If you're going to relate a "truth is stranger than fiction" story, please tell one that is actually true. In reading the Opus story above, I immediately recognized crap, and a quick search of the Internet (try "Ronald Opus", 1994) verified my unsurprising conclusion. |
Trina Green
Hunger Member
Post Number:
65
Registered: 03-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, June 01, 2004 - 01:18 pm: | |
So then the death must be classified as a suicide since it was the son who loaded the gun hoping Dad would kill Mom. Or since he would have lived, The homicide suspect and victim are the same individual. Wow nice story and a fitting ending. |
Perry Comer
Unity Member
Post Number:
1389
Registered: 04-2002
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, June 02, 2004 - 05:17 am: | |
on the subject of movies - TIMELINE - was mentioned
this weekend I saw TROY - it was a great movie but Homer would have cried his eyes out as the author seeing his work chewed up
Anyone see this flick?
http://www.pacwriter.netfirms.com/ |
Laurel Johnson
Unity Member
Post Number:
3066
Registered: 01-2002
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, June 02, 2004 - 06:15 am: | |
I did not see it Perry. Is that the one with Brad Pitt? |
Perry Comer
Unity Member
Post Number:
1390
Registered: 04-2002
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, June 02, 2004 - 06:20 am: | |
Yep, Brad impersonating Val Kilmer and doing a great job
I found the movie to be better than lORD OF THE RINGS: RETURN OF THE KING
the only problem was the "literary license" taken by the writers. Homer, as I said, would weep
http://www.pacwriter.netfirms.com/ |
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